The first was helping the gunsmiths. Johnson, at once one of the great gun designers and one of the least known, produced a steady flow of new firearm designs for Winchester. Small depression in the magazine tube, as shown in pictures. Although acquired many years apart, the two duck guns are of nearly the same vintages, 1952 and 1953. THE VENTILATED RIB IS BY SIMMONS GIN, 16ga, Full Choke, 26" barrel with a bright and shiny bore. Simmons Gun Specialties rib has been added to barrel. His Super Fox 12 gauge magnum double averaged 83.7% (two-barrel average) of 1 3/8ounces of shot under the same conditions. I know the patent date for this rib was 1919. THE SHOT GUN IS IN VERY GOOD CONDITION , WITH A 28 IN VENTILATED RIB BARREL WITH FULL CHOKE. Lot 6593: Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun . Elmer Keith instructs:For the man who wants greater range and a bigger shot load for duck or goose shooting, the Model 12 Winchester is in a class by itself [with] the long 3 load. Nevertheless, the 1 7/8-ounce load appeared in the mid-50s and now a full two ounces of shot can be had in the 12 magnum. Thereafter, a staggering number of variations were produced during the 1912-1980 period. A 2pin vent rib lets the shooter sight under the bird and keep the bird in sight. Winchester symbol # G1285S. Numbers match on barrel and receiver. Shooting the Model 12 Duck Gun I own two Model 12 duck guns. Its been debated over the years if the solid rib model 12 barrel were silver brazed or fused with heat? And make the 42 any grade you want and a self described winchester know it all couldn't tell the differance and may have bought one. Alarm calls! $550 USD. On the other hand, a duck caught in the middle of one of these dense-centered pattern sat 40 yards would receive a dozen or more pellets. Charles Askins is the father of the late Colonel Charles Askins, Jr., of course. Twelve magnum guns grew lighter over the years and consequently kick harder. The Model 12 duck guns are still as suitable for waterfowl passes, fox trails or the habitat of the wary gobbler as they were when the duck hunters at Winchester surprised the market in 1935. (no choke stamp on barrel). the shot gun is in very good condition , with a 28 in ventilated rib barrel with full choke. The nearest thing to a Model Twelve that could appear, whether domestic or foreign, would be a shotgun with the same model designation, but it would not and could not be a Model Twelve. Browning, in fact, did import foreign-made copies of the Model 12 after Madis wrote the above. Winchester Model 12 Skeet Gun 12 gauge with 25" Solid Rib Barrel - 12 GA: 0 1d 7h 25m 17240921. Also, it was the only 1 3/8-ounce magnum load available. Both guns were disassembled, cleaned and lightly oiled before testing. Guns.com is built to be simple easily organized products, useful descriptions from experts, and support to guide you to the right choice. L.O.P. The silhouette provides a precise aiming point. I have a questionwhen a gun is described as having a "milled rib" I thought that referred to the fact that the barrel had posts that were milled as part of the barrel instead of being attachedI see guns described as having "round post milled ribs" I don't think that is correct? Nash Buckingham was one of the great duck-hunting writers of the period. Manufactured in 1962. Not sure how many of you know this, but the rib has a serial number stamped on the underside of them with the same number stamped on the underside of the barrel. The Model 12 duck gun came to market at the all-time low point of duck populations in the United States. The Model 12 Duck Gun is a highly specialized tool for hunters who need to put a lot of shot on target at 60 yards or more. Yes the 2-pin milled rib was costly to manufacture. We have a FORE ARM HAS A PEICE OF WOOD MI, This is an all original 1962 made Winchester Model 12 in the harder to find 16 Gauge. is 14" with pad. The finishes and rib are 100% Winchester and in great condi, Used Winchester Model 12 20 Gauge 26" barrel WS-1choked skeet Cutts compensator with restriction inserts good condition Buyer pays shipping Millers Gun Center Located in New, Winchester Model 12 pump action 12ga shotgun. The less pronounced pistol grip-style buttstock of the original Model 12 was discontinued in late 1934 and is not found on duck guns. I used to club trap targets with it. Westerns 3-inch 12-gauge magnum with 1 3/8-ounces of shot was introduced the same year. You are correct. Some patterns of #4 shot might let a duck escape if it were caught just inside the margin of the 30-inch circle. Later pump guns, such as the Remington Model 870 and Mossberg Model 500, do not have the slide lock feature. Get Guns.com offers and news!! Dolphin717, please give us a page reference in Stadt where he mentions Simmons sending Model 12s with ribs back to Winchester for finishing, and/or marketing. The duck guns reputation was made with the one and five-eighths ounce load, the heaviest 12 magnum load from about 1935 to the mid-1950s. Bore is excellent. Get 12 Issues a year of the country's best firearms writing. Curious, I fired five additional patterns at 60 yards with Model 12 number 1418XXX and the Winchester load of 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot. A lot of us will have to begin learning to hit long-range ducks. Sounds like an invitation to join the long-range duck hunting cult! But it would be my guess that the wood has been refinished and the gun has been reblued. . Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Chamber marked 2 3/4", choke marked full, and 14" LOP. The shotgun featured here was made in 1976 and is in stellar condition. It was John Olin who inspired Westerns revolutionary Super-Xshotshell in 1921. We need to talk model 12's sometime. Ernie special order model 12's from Winchester to add his Dounut Vent Rib. I have read the 3 different books I have on model 12's from cover to cover many times. The receiver is heavier and so is the barrel. In fact, Madis states Any twelve gauge Model Twelve could be re-chambered and reworked to shoot three inch shells for a small additional charge[by Winchester], yet few guns were reworked in this way. I can find no external differences in receiver dimensions, other than the ejection port, between standard and magnum versions. 30" Full choke barrel. 12 Gauge, For sale is the Winchester Model 12. Buckingham had a solid 60-yard duck gun and was on his way to becoming a legend. 26" Vent Rib Barrels Choked SKEET. seller description. JavaScript is disabled. It is not as slow or pokey as one might expect. The staff shot skeet with the gun and concluded It is not as fast as the standard Model-12, but nearly so., In further shooting tests the staff found We could not discern any practical difference in recoil effect when shooting standard three inch heavy duck loads. Winchester supplied two boxes of 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8-ounces of #5 chilled shot pushed by four drams equivalent of powder. Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. K-Mart Classics: Remingtons Nylon Rimfires Engineered To Last. Save my name and email to use for future comments. However, Winchester and his succeeding family members successfully managed Winchester Repeating Arms Company from 1866 to 1919. The era of the double gun was ending as World War II approached. Thomas C. Johnson came to Winchester in 1885 and remained a dedicated employee until his death in 1934. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Need Help?service@guns.comCall (866)582-4867, PO Box 1131 13800 Nicollet Blvd Burnsville, MN 55337 2023Guns.com. M, ventilated rib, mid 1950's manufacture, completely original, only one ever produced by Winchester, ultimate rarity for the Model 12 co, 12ga, #1737096, standard gun that has been restocked and has a Simmons ventilated rib added, 12ga, 30 inch barrel, full choke, 2 3/4 inch chamber, 14 3/4 inch LOP with "Decelerator" pad, blu, Winchester Model 12 - 20ga - 26 - Improved Cylinder- NIB - UNFIRED - SN: MT0162 - AS NEW with high figured wood, Winchester Model 12 28 gauge Skeet solid rib. Buckingham is jump-shooting with his big double gun. $899.97. John Olin initiated an analysis of Winchesters commercial line in 1942. your community AND if they have it in stock, you can pick your gun up Jack OConnor was there and sets the scene nicely in the Complete Book of Shooting. Has a Cutz on the end of the barrel. *** RARE *** Winchester Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN limited production run that combines the pre-64 Model 12 with a 12 ga. Magnum 30" barrel, factory production 3" Magnum, with a factory Simmons Vent Rib on an upgraded wood stock! 30" Vent Rib Excellent White Front . Their attitude is summed up by Elmer Keith in Shotguns by Keith: the satisfaction of seeing big ducks crumple at long range and come down and bounce on the ground or splash high in the water is the cream of shotgun shooting., It is my view that the long-range duck-hunting cult was a legacy from the days of market hunting. Winchester was bankrupt and went into receivership in January 1931. Probably a lot farther than we can hit em. He was the chief designer of the Model 21 double, John Olins favorite. Blue is good showing wear on high spots. Askins Ithaca 10-gauge double with 2 7/8-inch chambers averaged 86.9% with 1 5/8-ounces of shot. As to price, it will also depend on gauge, barrel length, choke, barrel steel, wood type, pad vs. plate, etc. Optional dimensions for straight or pistol grip stocks, grip caps, front sights and recoil pads were also among early options. A study of Michael McIntoshs book Best Guns indicates that a few thousand of the specialized waterfowl doubles of all brands were sold between 1921 and 1941. When winchester changed the chamber to 3" did they mark the barrels or reproof? Epic 22 Pocket Pistol: The Beretta 71 Jaguar. Franklin and his two sons John M. Olin and Spencer T. Olin were the managers of Olin Industries and Western Cartridge Company in 1931. The takedown joints are tight (See the instructions in Madis book if your Model 12 has a loose take-down joint). Deluxe checkered walnut, Its new in the original box with associate paperwork in wrapping paper.. has mi, Metal surfaces rate very good, handling marks to wood. Copyright 1995-2023 eBay Inc. All Rights Reserved. That is why I have never used one of my duck guns for duck hunting. In 1963, when production ended, Riffles book shows no options available. An incredible collector grade limited production 1953 Model 12 HEAVY DUCK GUN SIMMONS VENT RIB that is offered below Blue Book value. You are also correct that the different rib styles used on Model 12's can get confusing..EG. SAME RECEIVER AS MODEL 12 BUT MAD, Guns Listing ID: 640773MAKE - WINCHESTERMODEL - 12FINISH - BLUEDBARREL - 28\"CALIBER - 12 GAUGECAPACITY - N/AGRIPS - WOODCONDITION - VERY GOODFEATURES - HYDRACOIL STOCK & MODIFIED BARREL, Winchester Model 1912 Nickel Steel 20 gauge EARLY Serial # Up for sale is a used Winchester Model 1912 Nickel Steel 20 ga, 2 3/4" chamber, 24" VR barrel stamped full but reads IM on a bra, Winchester - Model 12 Factory Try-Gun, 12ga. I sold 41 model 12's and 21's at a gun auction in Wichita Kansas to accommodate the move. Charles Askins was the leading expert on shotguns in the first half of the last century. WARNING! "Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known." Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. service to the online gun buying experience that is unheard of. The Olins bought Winchester for $8.1 million through a combination of $3.3 million cash and the balance in an issue of preferred stock. , The Winchester Model 12 Y series was introduced in 1972 and made until about 1984. Winchester ~ Model 12 Custom~ 12 GA Used Guns. I have a donut post trap gun but not a pigeon, had two 3 inch guns, one had donut post the other had a round post. Clear (Winchester Wikipedia Page) 27 Item(s) Found Page 1 1. The steel has a nice patina and the stock has most of the lacquer worn off. Did they actually produce any in 1919 or did it take some time to get them out to the public after patent was approved? This shotgun is in near new condition in the original box. Remington's Nylon 66 semi-automatic .22 LR rifles have grown from 1950s bargain buys to 21st century collectors darlings. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's Very good condition overall. This gun has been single family owned since bought used in 1967. Learn how your comment data is processed. Great communications. Range was 40 yards from gun muzzle to target frame. Made in 1928, 12 Gauge, 28"" barrel. My wife shot her share of ducks with a 20-gauge autoloader bored Improved Cylinder shooting one ounce of #7 1/2-shot. Note: The posting of Copyrighted material on this forum is prohibited without This combination, which averaged 83.6% at 40 yards, averaged 44.2% at 60 yards! 3-inch Super Twelve Shotshell My copy of Winchesters Catalog No. But getting back to the original question, a Simmons rib does detract from the value of a Model 12 and most people will turn away from them. Must ship to an FFL. From its debut until the end of the 1950's, the Winchester Model 1912 was the pump shotgun, long known as "the perfect repeater." Popularly named the Perfect Repeater at its introduction, it largely set the standard for pump action shotguns over its 51-year high-rate production life. own to figure out what you want. It's what was refered to as a "Olympic Rib". Refresh your browser window to try again. The funds are returned to the states for wildlife restoration projects. This Model 12 has Serial Number 1391884 was produced in 1953. The 30" heavy barrel is proof stamped "WINCHESTER TRADE MARK MADE IN THE U.S.A."; "-MODEL 12 - 12 GA. - FULL"; "WINCHESTER PROOF STEEL"; "FOR SUPER SPEED & SUPER - X 3 IN.". There are 16 pages of loads for various shell lengths, shot sizes (dust through buck, soft or chilled), five powders, five shell grades and 11 gauges. Helping out a person with 3378 posts who if they spent 5min. And you are not right about them becouse the model 12 evolved over time with improvements you didn't seem to catch becouse you are probable not a shooter. Now I have never been wrong about anything in my lifeLOLjust kidding, but the way I read it on the top of page 109JMHOThanks, WC. Can you help me out? Possible the fore end has been either replaced or re done. - Top Rated Plus - opens in a new window or tab, - eBay Money Back Guarantee - opens in a new window or tab. Here-tofore, you could only shoot this weight of shot in a 10-gauge double gun with 2 7/8-inch chambers, or the new Ithaca Magnum 10. I know of a gun shop in Idaho that can take about any model 42 and put on round post ribs or solid ribs that are just like factory original with the proof marks. The trap load was included because trap shooting is suited to the duck gun. Stadt's book is a very good book that alot of people don't seem to know about. 1938 lists the stock for a 12 gauge skeet grade as 14" with a Buttplate. I recently acquired a 1921 gun. the ventilated rib is by simmons gin works. 12 Gauge, This is a very nice Winchester Model 12 Trap pump action shotgun in 12 gauge. These were called long-range waterfowl guns.. Spend your time enjoying the gun you want, not getting frustrated with a complex website that makes gun buying hard. Tried to talk him out of doing it and sell him a build up gun but he wanted a vent rib on it as it was his dad's gun. Most books say they did not. The $48 price tag was right. Action works perfectly. He worked with another Winchester researcher. Winchester Model 12 1940's gun. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. community. Winchester - Model 12, Deluxe, Pump Action, RARE 28ga. Generally, a Simmons rib gun will bring a higher price than a plain barrel gun, and a lower price than a solid rib or Winchester vent rib gun, all other factors being equal. Simmons also removed Solid Ribs from barrels and added his rib to those barrels. would buy from again without hesitation, Smith & Wesson S&W Vintage Screwdriver 8 Row Knurled Handle used (#234907824646), Remington 700 stamped metal Magazine Follower .222 .223 .17 used nice (#334728927905). This gives a wrinkled appearance on bottom of pistol grip and bottom of forend. Action works very nicely. This is a 12 GA pump shotgun manufactured in 1950. becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. The straight grip stock, optional from 1935, was discontinued in the late 1950s. Produced in 1961. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. My 1953 duck gun has the factory solid rib. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Winchester Model 12 12 ga 26" oal aftermarket poly choke and vent rib at the best online prices at eBay! The marsh is in riot! Open Fullscreen. We get the FFL from your store others make you find it, copy it, and fax it. Buy a Winchester Model 12 12ga., 30-inch Full choke, Simmons ventilated rib; this gun was made in 1941 (se for sale by Vintage Sporting on GunsAmerica.com the best online marketplace for buying and selling semi auto pistols, firearms, accessories, and collectibles : 963027340 Mar 24, 2023 Winchester Model 12 Shotgun $150 Mar 24, 2023 Two Winchester Pump Shotguns $150 Mar 24, 2023 L.C. The fact that the Winchester proof marks are now 'off set', caused me to believe the gun may have been returned to the factory for the rib installation. ORIGINAL BOX INCLUDED. The famous Winchester Model 1912 pump shotgun was designed by Winchester's Thomas C. Johnson. The first thing you notice when you pick up a duck gun is its weight and solid feel. Modified choke. The 12-gauge 3-inch magnum shotshell was developed to achieve this objective. The committee appointed to study the requirements for continuing business reported a successful reorganization would require the raising of a substantial amount of new capital. That capital was supplied by the Olin family of Olin Industries, owners of Western Cartridge Company. Most everything can be easily bought online these days. It still is. Field grade pump gun with Mod choke barrel. A red rubber Winchesterre coil pad was added the first year of production. Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Vent RibManufactured in 1952. Olin included his new Super-X magnum 3-inch shells loaded with 1 3/8 ounces of shot. The buttstock was reshaped on Model 12 shotguns again in the mid-1950s. Winchester Pre War Mod 12 Trap 2 Barrel Set 12ga, Winchester Pre 64 Mod 12 DU Illinios No.1 Engraved by M Dubber, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 HEAVY DUCK 12GA 3 INCH MAGNUM, Winchester Model 12 16 Gauge rare 2-barrel set, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, Winchester Mod 12 Vent Rib B-Carved Wood 12ga, "Winchester Model 12 Shotgun 12 Gauge (W12258), Winchester, Ducks Unlimited, Model 12, 12 Ga, Shotgun, Winchester Model 21 Heavy Duck, 12ga, 30" 3" mag, Briley Chokes, Winchester Model 12 12 ga. Deluxe Skeet grade w/ factory Cutts, Winchester Model 1912 Nickel Steel 20 gauge 24" VR bbl EARLY Serial #. Duck hunters bought 12-gauge doubles with 3-inch chambers to use the new Super-X magnum load, the Super Twelve as it was soon called. another state. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. There was no need to shoot ducks at 60 yards. "SN:561491. Simmons vent rib and custom AA+ walnut furniture. Westerns copper-plated shot, introduced about 1925, extended shotgun range even further. Charles Askins, in an article entitled Long Range Shotguns in the January 1930 issue of the American Rifleman, concludes that a 12-gauge magnum with 1 3/8-ounces of shot, patterning 80% or better is pretty reliable [on ducks] at 65 yards. However, Askins goes on to say I have never, personally, had a shotgun which would reach far enough. Before the eight gauge was banned in 1918, Askins had a Greener eight-gauge double with 36-inch barrels weighing 13 pounds. The Olins soon added to the attractiveness of the Model 12 duck gun by bringing out a new 1 5/8-ounce load for the 3-inch shell. George Watrous, a longtime Winchester employee with many talents, was commissioned to investigate the good and bad points of Winchesters pre-war line and make suggestions for postwar improvement. Riffle's excellent reference book on the Model 12 notes the 1919 patent date for the two-pin rib, but suggests that the rib was not on the market until 1920. McIntosh notes that the Super-X shotshell was a breakthrough to the modern age of shotgun ammunition. In a full-page ad in the September 1926 issue of the American Rifleman, Western claimed Killing power 15 to 20 yards beyond the effective range of ordinary loads.This was based on a documented reduction in stringing of the shot charge, from about 20 feet to about 4 feet, at 42 yards. However, the gun for which Johnson is best remembered is his Model 12 pump-action shotgun, The Perfect Repeater.. And our Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known. Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. Item . The earliest gun they found with a 2-pin rib has a serial number of 2037xx with a date of June 30th, 1919. Although the quality of the rib will be the same as the original Winchester, the only way a Simmons rib looks OK on a Model 12 is if they DON'T put their silly name down the side of the rib. Winchester installed Simmons ribs and Simmons-designed ventilated ribs for several years. As you know that, Winchester Model 12 (factory original) 28-gauge pump action shotgun. The gun weighed 8 1/2 pounds with its 32-inch Full choke barrel. Winchester stated both 2 1/2 and 2 3/4 shells perform satisfactorily in this [duck] gun. The ejection port of the duck gun is about 1/8-inch longer than the standard port. The new value of a WINCHESTER MODEL 12 shotgun has fallen ($937.31) dollars over the past 12 months to a price of $484.80 . It is possible for the slide lock to fail to unlock the action during recoil. MAKE OFFER. The Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck Gun Proved Itself a Shooter, Colt No Longer Exclusive Owner of M4 Rifle, Mossberg 940 Pro Turkey & Tactical Review: Shotgun Shangri-La, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Fossari CRX9 Sporting Over/Under, SHOT Show 2023 Picks: Browning Citori High Grade 50th Anniversary, 8 On-Target Concealed Carry Insurance Options (2022), 10 Affordable Double-Barrel Shotgun Options (2022), Best AR-15 Options For Any Budget And Buyers Guide (2022), Best Concealed Carry Handguns For Women (2022). A new chamber ring and a # 1 heavy draw adjusting sleeve.